Defining the Haven Guard (or whatever their name turns out to be)

[Mister Phes]

Design a NEW LEGO Pirates Sub-Theme

DEFINING THE HAVEN GUARD

Poll Results

"Haven Guard" was the most popular name while Orange was the most preferred uniform (see above poll).

We shall now finalise the Haven Guard in this thread.

This is a poll to determine the most suitable name and torso colour for the faction with the working title of "Haven Guard".

The name

"Haven Guard" was selected as the working title because:

• "Haven" means harbour in Dutch so it adheres nicely with our Dutch Merchants
  
• "Haven" is a simple two syllable word which most 5 year olds should be able to say
  
• "Haven" also has connotations with being a friendly place. Dictionary.com defines the English definition as "any place of shelter and safety; "
  

If you have a suggestion for a different name, select "other" and post your suggestion in this thread.

If you support a suggestion, simply quote the suggestion in a new post. If a suggestion proves popular it may be added to the poll.

The colour

Orange was selected because:

• Orange hasn't been used as a torso colour in any previous LEGO Pirate sets
  
• It's synonymous with Dutch history and aristocracy.
  

In the Defining the Factions thread numerous colours have been suggested, however, the aim of this poll is not to explore every colour possibility available, but to narrow it down. So the three most popular colour choices (excluding shades) have been added to the poll. We shall determine the the most appropriate shade after the colour has been selected.

[David Thomsen]

I voted for 'Colonial Guard' just because I think it's something the Lego company are more likely to use, but if that wasn't my consideration I would have gone with Haven Guard. The name has kind of grown on me.

[Matthias]

I voted for colonial guards, because in my opinion there should be no direct reference to real existing nations. As there should be no reference to races, religions etc. And I think that a dutch word is a direct reference.

[Bonaparte]

I went for colonial guard (hoping LEGO doesn't think the word 'colonial' has a negative connotation) and for orange as color for the uniforms.

[Sebeus I]

I picked Haven Guard because it's very neutral, I don't like the sound of colonial or company and I think LEGO wouldn't like those either.

Uniform color = green because I find black a boring color and I don't like orange at all (nothing against my Dutch neighbours, it's only the color I don't like )

Edited May 31, 2014 by Sebeus I

[Random Guy]

Colonial Guards is a good neutral term, and the time period is often called the Colonial Era.

I don't think orange would work too well, as it's too close to red and would be confused with the Imperial Guards.

[Ardelon]

I voted for Haven Guard, because why not. It should be stressed that "haven" is a perfectly fitting word in English, and it isn't overtly Dutch. The Colonial Guard is a close second.

For the color, I voted for green, as black is too dark and dull, while orange is too garish and "cloudcuckoolandish". Green is a nice in-between color, respectable and serious, as befits a military force.

[Lady K]

I voted for Haven Guard as the name. I really didn't like the sound of the other choices ( too formal and rigid sounding) and given that as much as we want this, Lego will make the sets with children in mind. Haven Guard has such a nice feel to it.

I also voted for orange for the color as I think it will look nice and complement the other uniform colors made in the past. Orange is a warm and friendly color, again I think children would like it.

[rodiziorobs]

My votes:

Haven Guard: I don't think 'colonial' fits. Haven isn't my favorite, but I can't think of anything better, and I do like that it is decidedly neutral.

Green: although I would like to see the blue trim in silver instead. While orange would not be a bad color for the figs, I think a green insignia/flag/sail emblem would look better than orange, so I would say green overall.

Edited May 31, 2014 by rodiziorobs

[Comrade Commander]

I voted Colonial Guard. While Haven Guard doesn't sound too weird to me phonetically, I don't think it gives the same feel for the sets. Haven to me sounds like paradise, and thus it makes the soldiers the auto good guys. Some folks may want to side with the smugglers (or whatever we call them). By making the guards "colonial" it allows the player to decide whether the soldiers are good or bad, and enhances the plot line a little more.

And for those that think Colonial has a bad perception, don't forget we have already had "Imperial" soldiers, which is a much stronger word.

In terms of color. I picked black, but I could handle green. orange is too comical, and can't be intertwined with the other units as well. I also think that the torso design should be different with these colors, which could make orange slightly more appealing.

Edited May 31, 2014 by Comrade Commander

[Brig. Brick]

name: colonial guard

color: black

About the name: colonial guard is the best name for this time, like the older names "imperial soldiers" (bluecoats), "imperial guards" (redcoats) and "imperial armada" (the armada), that worked just fine for the old sets

About the color: the color depends mostly on the background history of the soldiers factions, for me, black is the best choice, because, for example, could work like the spanish armada as seen as in the "PoTC on stranger tides", opening the chance to use shackos, tricorns and the musketeer hat for the high ranks.

Black could be a very "serious" color, but could be mixing with "clear" colors (green, orange, white, golden), but as I said, all depends of the background

[tedbeard]

I agree with most of the reasons people have quoted above for supporting "Colonial Guard" but for those very reasons and one more that people may not have considered, I supported "Company Guard".

I cannot support "Colonial" as the legacy of colonialism is far to controversial to be used. If you thought the Maoris raised a stink over the appropriation of their culture for the original Bionicle names (see: BBC article) then using an identifier that includes the word "Colonial" is too contentious for the LEGO brand. We are trying to make a fun, child-friendly toy line, not educate children on post-colonial politics.

[Bob De Quatre]

It's only my opinion, and I can't produce marketing data about it, but I am sure at 99% that "Colonial guards", translated to "Gardes coloniaux", cannot be used in France... Colonialism for France as a strong negative connotation (yes we did slavery and all sort of bad things), it ended pretty bad not many decades ago, and even today we are engaged in military operation in Africa in territory we colonized in the past...

[Matthias]

It's only my opinion, and I can't produce marketing data about it, but I am sure at 99% that "Colonial guards", translated to "Gardes coloniaux", cannot be used in France... Colonialism for France as a strong negative connotation (yes we did slavery and all sort of bad things), it ended pretty bad not many decades ago, and even today we are engaged in military operation in Africa in territory we colonized in the past...

For everybody who think TLG would not use the world colonial, because of the history. TLG called the bluecoats =Kolonialbeamte= in german witch is translated =colonial officers= in english. We just not have to much of anticipatory obedience in terms of reshipping potential problems.

Furthermore who is the difference between colonial and imperial, is nearly the same.

[Comrade Commander]

Not only do I think "colonial" could be used like I said before, I think it might help play into the line better.

Since there seems to be a wide range of opions on colonialism, it will help increase the play factor.

For those that see colonialism as bad, they can see the smugglers as good. The freedom fighters of sorts.

For those that have a more positive view of colonialism, they can see the smugglers as more the bad guys in the equation.

The official story could be written vague enough so that the cultures around the world could develop their own diverse interpretation

[David Thomsen]

And for those that think Colonial has a bad perception, don't forget we have already had "Imperial" soldiers, which is a much stronger word.

I agree with this, to me 'Imperial' has more negative connotations than 'Colonial'. In popular culture, an 'Empire' tends to be a fascist and/or expansive force of domination and subjugation, whereas a 'Colony' is more likely to be a peaceful group of settlers.

I guess my perspective comes from living in New Zealand, which is a British colony with very good (contemporary) race relations.

[Mister Phes]

"Colonial" doesn't necessarily imply invasion or displacement, like others have noted, colonisation could be peaceful, mutual or at least neutral.

So "Colonial" in a sub-theme name isn't a problem from my perspective, it just doesn't seem the most appropriate name for the thematic.

Essentially we're dealing with those who police the Merchant's harbour, but if they were policing the Settler's harbour then Colonial Guard would be spot on.

[Bob De Quatre]

Ok I understand what you said about "Colonial", we are a worldwide community and we have different vision and/or opinion on the matter, and I respect that. Still I think in France "colonial" won't be used, but as

Matthias130182 said, it could be renamed for specific market.

[Comrade Commander]

"Colonial" doesn't necessarily imply invasion or displacement, like others have noted, colonisation could be peaceful, mutual or at least neutral.

So "Colonial" in a sub-theme name isn't a problem from my perspective, it just doesn't seem the most appropriate name for the thematic.

Essentially we're dealing with those who police the Merchant's harbour, but if they were policing the Settler's harbour then Colonial Guard would be spot on.

Right, but weren't majority of the islands in the caribbean at the time were colonies? The trade ports were mostly run by businesses sure, but they had royal govenors and answered to the crown.

Colonies, for right or wrong, were established because of resources & initially bankroled by the ruling power in the home country. So it would only make sense for merchants to be working closely with colonial powers.

Edited June 4, 2014 by Comrade Commander

[Mister Phes]

Right, but weren't majority of the islands in the caribbean at the time were colonies? The trade ports were mostly run by businesses sure, but they had royal govenors and answered to the crown.

Historically yes, but for the purposes of a LEGO sub-theme we're not going to have a backstory that elaborate - It needs to be as simple and straight forward as possible.

Therefore Haven Guards for Port van Brickhaven, Colonial Guards can for a future colony sub-theme (if we ever get round to making one).

See how "Haven Guard" requires very little explanation for their role at Port Van Brickhaven? Call them the "Colonial Guard" and then there needs to be more backstory to tie the two together.

[tedbeard]

See how "Haven Guard" requires very little explanation for their role at Port Van Brickhaven? Call them the "Colonial Guard" and then there needs to be more backstory to tie the two together.

Actually you need a lot of backstory if we are going with "Port Van Brickhaven". If that is the name of the town/settlement/colony then the proper term would be "Brickhaven Guard" which FWIW sounds a lot better to me.

[Bob De Quatre]

Actually you need a lot of backstory if we are going with "Port Van Brickhaven". If that is the name of the town/settlement/colony then the proper term would be "Brickhaven Guard" which FWIW sounds a lot better to me.

I really like "Brickhaven Guard" too

[Mister Phes]

Actually you need a lot of backstory if we are going with "Port Van Brickhaven". If that is the name of the town/settlement/colony then the proper term would be "Brickhaven Guard" which FWIW sounds a lot better to me.

I'm not opposed to Brickhaven Guard but nobody else has supported it... yet.

Although, I thought it would be obvious that the Haven Guard belonged to Port Van Brickhaven just by looking at the name.

Let's say a well known harbour has a harbour guard... Sydney Harbour will do. Is it necessary to say "Sydney Harbour Guard" every time, or would people understand what you were referring to if you just used "habour guard"?

What are some other opinions?

[tedbeard]

I'm not opposed to Brickhaven Guard but nobody else has supported it... yet.

Well, it wasn't on the poll and it's a little late for a write-in campaign under "other".

[Mister Phes]

The poll can run until Saturday (June 7) so there's still time for others to express their enthusiasm for the name.